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Kooshmeister
STERANKO!!!
USA
1574 Posts |
 Posted - June 16 2005 : 02:43:59 AM
 
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This is one, I think, that's only for Star Wars fans who actually care about the minor background characters, and I wouldn't be surprised if this didn't get too many replies. Still, it's been bugging the hell out of me all week so I figured I might as well bring it up.
In Attack of the Clones Nute Gunray goes around with a seemingly anonymous Neimoidian sidekick in a funny hat (wait, scratch that; all the Neimoidians wear funny hats). According to the Episode II Visual Dictionary as well as other sources, this individual's name is Gilramos Libkath and he's played by David Healey and voiced by Christopher Truswell, but according to the end credits of the film it's Lott Dod played by Alan Ruscoe, who spoke out against Queen Amidala in The Phantom Menace's Senate hearing scene.
Ordinarily I would not dispute the credits, except that Lott Dod and this supposed Gilramos Libkath fellow look and sound nothing alike. Dod has beady little eyes, a loose neck wattle, and a big jutting chin; Libkath has large eyes, a droopy mouth with thick lips, and almost no chin to speak of. I read one theory that this is an "older" Lott Dod since several years did pass between the events in The Phantom Menace and Attack of the Clones, but Nute Gunray, who also appeared in TPM, looks exactly the same in AOTC.
This, to me, implies that not only are the Neimoidians a very long-lived species, they also don't age physically the way humans do. Therefore, I can only conclude that this Neimoidian is not Lott Dod, and is clearly someone else entirely, and that the Alan Ruscoe credit in AOTC is a mistake.
I dunno, what does anyone else think? :)
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Mike Nelson: You people bring matches for Mikey?
Tom Servo: You shut up, Mikey! You shut up!
Admiral Ozzel: Duh, oh-- Hey! We're almost done with your pancakes! Sorry about the wait!
Darth Vader: I wanted waffles, not pancakes. You may die. |
Edited by - Kooshmeister on June 16 2005 02:47:04 AM |
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Hokum
wants his two dollars
United Kingdom
925 Posts |
Posted - June 16 2005 : 05:50:40 AM
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I think that you think about this stuff wayyy too much.  |
Meatwad: So, it's either you definitely should not play with matches, or you definitely should.
Carl (looking at his burnt house): It's definitely one or the other. |
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Mr. Paradox
Most Empty of Emotions
USA
687 Posts |
Posted - June 16 2005 : 06:42:57 AM
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| I wonder if it truly matters, given that (spoiler) none of the Neimodians get out of Episode III alive (spoiler end). |
"I hit rock bottom/and then I fell in a hole/and then I fell through the floor of that hole some more..." |
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B-Movie Bodhisattiva
Commander
USA
211 Posts |
Posted - June 16 2005 : 09:35:57 AM
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| Here's a question: Are the Neimodians, with their Asian stereotype "Me so Solly!" voices, a racist slur or just evidence of really bad judgement? |
George Orwell was correct in his predictions of life in the year 1984... except that Big Brother's name was Huey Lewis |
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christian rosenkreutz
will never see heaven or home
Christmas Island
2426 Posts |
Posted - June 16 2005 : 10:39:42 AM
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| Can't they be both? |
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Radar
can see your schmutzklitzen!
USA
3635 Posts |
Posted - June 16 2005 : 11:46:57 AM
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| The Phantom Nemotode. lol |
Watch out for snakes! |
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Radar
can see your schmutzklitzen!
USA
3635 Posts |
Posted - June 16 2005 : 11:48:11 AM
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| There were ETs in the Senate, but Eliot showed E T his Star Wars dolls, circe 1977. Weird! |
Watch out for snakes! |
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Kooshmeister
STERANKO!!!
USA
1574 Posts |
Posted - June 16 2005 : 11:59:07 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by B-Movie Bodhisattiva
Here's a question: Are the Neimodians, with their Asian stereotype "Me so Solly!" voices, a racist slur or just evidence of really bad judgement?
Maybe I'm just naive, but I never saw any Asian stereotyping with those characters until someone pointed them out. Personally I don't see what the problem is. They're nonhuman alien lizards. They can't be a racist slur.
At any rate, it anyone is an Asian stereotype in the SW universe it's got to be Nien Nunb (?), Lando's co-pilot in Return of the Jedi. |
Mike Nelson: You people bring matches for Mikey?
Tom Servo: You shut up, Mikey! You shut up!
Admiral Ozzel: Duh, oh-- Hey! We're almost done with your pancakes! Sorry about the wait!
Darth Vader: I wanted waffles, not pancakes. You may die. |
Edited by - Kooshmeister on June 16 2005 12:00:07 PM |
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B-Movie Bodhisattiva
Commander
USA
211 Posts |
Posted - June 16 2005 : 1:50:50 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Kooshmeister
Maybe I'm just naive, but I never saw any Asian stereotyping with those characters until someone pointed them out. Personally I don't see what the problem is. They're nonhuman alien lizards. They can't be a racist slur.
At any rate, it anyone is an Asian stereotype in the SW universe it's got to be Nien Nunb (?), Lando's co-pilot in Return of the Jedi.
Ok, I'm willing to rule on "bad judgement" then. Same for Jar-Jar. |
George Orwell was correct in his predictions of life in the year 1984... except that Big Brother's name was Huey Lewis |
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CineBomb2
Vegas Visor
USA
4135 Posts |
Posted - June 16 2005 : 3:32:13 PM
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| Actually, I always suspected those aliens had a hint of stereotypical Asian in their accents. An even more obvious allusion to Asian cliches can be found in Battlefield Earth, where a servile alien of the Clinko race (whose name in the book version was actually Chinko if you can believe it) wearing an Oriental-esque robe acts as an informative computer system. ... Now I'm thinking about this too much. |
The CineBomb Site: www.cinebomb.wordpress.com |
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Demiurge
Alien DEVO Impersonator
USA
1156 Posts |
Posted - June 16 2005 : 9:21:41 PM
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To answer the original question, I think that Lott Dodd might be another of the Neimiodians on Geonosis; there are more than just Gunray and his majordomo, if I remember correctly.
And the Neimiodians are the one race that I think are suspect on the ethnic stereotype list (as opposed to the Gungans, who are just kinda dumb, not really racist). They really do sound vaguely stereotypically Asian, although not as much as some critics claimed. And Episodes II and III did take efforts to correct this, by giving Neimiodians beyond Nute Gunray different types of voices.
And am I the only one who felt sorry for Nute Gunray when he got killed in Episode Three? |
Oh no! He ate the Pope! |
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Kooshmeister
STERANKO!!!
USA
1574 Posts |
Posted - June 16 2005 : 9:37:29 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Demiurge
And Episodes II and III did take efforts to correct this, by giving Neimiodians beyond Nute Gunray different types of voices.
Indeed. I just got done watching AOTC again and Libkath has got a really deep, scary voice (a lot deeper than I remembered, actually) and an accent not at all like Gunray's or Dod's or any of the other Neimoidians from TPM.
quote:
Originally posted by Demiurge
And am I the only one who felt sorry for Nute Gunray when he got killed in Episode Three?
Actually no, I felt sorry for the poor guy, too. :( |
Mike Nelson: You people bring matches for Mikey?
Tom Servo: You shut up, Mikey! You shut up!
Admiral Ozzel: Duh, oh-- Hey! We're almost done with your pancakes! Sorry about the wait!
Darth Vader: I wanted waffles, not pancakes. You may die. |
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Kooshmeister
STERANKO!!!
USA
1574 Posts |
Posted - June 17 2005 : 7:38:43 PM
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I did some checking, and I think the debate is settled. The book Boba Fett: Hunted by Elizabeth Hand features a Neimoidian named Gilramos Libkath as its main villain, and as such he's featured on the cover (to Jabba's left):
Image hotlinked from http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v609/Kooshmeister/BOOK.jpg
I'm sure those who have seen AOTC will agree that that is in fact the deep-voiced Neimoidian seen hanging around with Nute Gunray on Geonosis. But just in case nobody remembers him:
Image hotlinked from http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v609/Kooshmeister/Nute_img06.jpg |
Mike Nelson: You people bring matches for Mikey?
Tom Servo: You shut up, Mikey! You shut up!
Admiral Ozzel: Duh, oh-- Hey! We're almost done with your pancakes! Sorry about the wait!
Darth Vader: I wanted waffles, not pancakes. You may die. |
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Groom Of The Atom
They called him Machete...
1338 Posts |
Posted - June 17 2005 : 8:27:19 PM
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| Just a little aside. That is some butt fugly graphic design. Does Potoshop 7 have a "suck ass" filter that I've neer seen before? |
He knows the score, he get's the women and he KILLS the bad guys!. |
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Kooshmeister
STERANKO!!!
USA
1574 Posts |
Posted - June 17 2005 : 8:34:39 PM
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I wouldn't know. I use Paint Shop Pro. ;)
In any event, all the Clone Wars novels look like that. They're hideous. |
Mike Nelson: You people bring matches for Mikey?
Tom Servo: You shut up, Mikey! You shut up!
Admiral Ozzel: Duh, oh-- Hey! We're almost done with your pancakes! Sorry about the wait!
Darth Vader: I wanted waffles, not pancakes. You may die. |
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Lyinar
Banned Forum Member
USA
1238 Posts |
Posted - June 17 2005 : 10:03:08 PM
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| At least Timothy Zahn's 'Thrawn Trilogy' has painted covers, rather than, as Groom of the Atom said, Photoshop covers using the 'suck ass' filter... Of course, I'm not a gambling man at all, but I'm willing to bet a substantial sum of money that the Thrawn Trilogy is MUCH better than the book exhibited in this thread. |
"I reject your reality and substitute my own!" -- Adam Savage, Mythbusters
Cthulhu: The only name misspelled more often than Lynyrd Skynyrd. |
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Sirkenz17
I'm Cherokee Jack!
USA
1619 Posts |
Posted - June 17 2005 : 10:06:41 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Kooshmeister
I did some checking, and I think the debate is settled. The book Boba Fett: Hunted by Elizabeth Hand features a Neimoidian named Gilramos Libkath as its main villain, and as such he's featured on the cover (to Jabba's left):
Image hotlinked from http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v609/Kooshmeister/BOOK.jpg
Ugh! It looks like a novice using photoshop!  |
"If you see anything, film it and put it in." --Tom Servo, MST3K Experiment #619: Red Zone Cuba
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Edited by - Sirkenz17 on June 17 2005 10:07:21 PM |
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Kooshmeister
STERANKO!!!
USA
1574 Posts |
Posted - June 17 2005 : 11:07:21 PM
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Hey, hey, hey, don't knock the book that proves I was right about Gilramos Libkath.
....
Wait, on second thought, yeah that cover does suck ass. Mock it all you want.
The story doesn't seem to be any better if any of the synopses and reviews I've read are any indication: fed up with the Separatists losing the Clone Wars, Libkath quits the Trade Federation and goes to become a slaver on Tatooine, where he muscles in on Jabba the Hutt's business. Jabba, being his usual fickle self, puts a big bounty on Libkath's head, and it's a ten-year-old Boba Fett who comes to collect.
About the only thing I can say in praise of that story is that it's nice to see someone doing something with one of the Neimoidians that isn't directly connected to the main plotline of the Clone War saga... but otherwise it sounds like crap. Because not only am I sick and tired of Boba Fett this and Boba Fett that, I'm also sick of them always going back to Tatooine.
Plus, one other element about the story is that the slaves Gilramos Libkath deals in are primarily children, so the author shamlessly plays the Child Endangerment card. The whole thing sounds like some Fett fanboy's (or fangirl's) crummy fanfiction. Then again, I tend to regard most all of the Expanded Universe stuff as nothing more than glorified fanfiction anyway. |
Mike Nelson: You people bring matches for Mikey?
Tom Servo: You shut up, Mikey! You shut up!
Admiral Ozzel: Duh, oh-- Hey! We're almost done with your pancakes! Sorry about the wait!
Darth Vader: I wanted waffles, not pancakes. You may die. |
Edited by - Kooshmeister on June 17 2005 11:13:04 PM |
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Demiurge
Alien DEVO Impersonator
USA
1156 Posts |
Posted - June 18 2005 : 12:12:36 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by Kooshmeister
The story doesn't seem to be any better if any of the synopses and reviews I've read are any indication: fed up with the Separatists losing the Clone Wars, Libkath quits the Trade Federation and goes to become a slaver on Tatooine, where he muscles in on Jabba the Hutt's business. Jabba, being his usual fickle self, puts a big bounty on Libkath's head, and it's a ten-year-old Boba Fett who comes to collect.
Shouldn't we at least wait until Boba can fit into the suit before he starts killing people? C'mon! Show some originality, licensed authors!
And I agree with you that the Expanded Universe is pretty much fan-fiction. Not that that's all bad; the Timothy Zahn books, for example, are excellent. |
Oh no! He ate the Pope! |
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B-Movie Bodhisattiva
Commander
USA
211 Posts |
Posted - June 20 2005 : 1:49:01 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Demiurge
And I agree with you that the Expanded Universe is pretty much fan-fiction. Not that that's all bad; the Timothy Zahn books, for example, are excellent.
IMO, the series pretty much went downhill after Zahn's Thrawn trilogy, dragging on with repetitions of identical plots involving lost Imperial superweapons and going even so far as to try to bring Thrawn back just to get back some goodwill.
Finally, the EU had reached its awful nadir with the emergence of the Yuuzann Vong. |
George Orwell was correct in his predictions of life in the year 1984... except that Big Brother's name was Huey Lewis |
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Axeman
CG Animator
United Kingdom
601 Posts |
Posted - June 21 2005 : 01:31:35 AM
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I read the Thrawn trilogy whilst on holiday once, and was pleasantly surprised at how much it didn't suck. I foolishly then thought it safe to move on to Kevin J Anderson SW novels and learned a hard lesson indeed about how much a novel can suck. Man, there's some criminally bad writing out there surrounding Mr Lucas and his creation.
On the Neimoidian/stereotype thing, did anyone notice that the Neimoidian Captain of General Greivous's ship in the opening sequence had a bloody awful American accent, somewhat like a Welshman attempting to sound like Bruce Willis? It grated far more than there old Asian style speech patterns, which suited them down to the ground. |
Mmmmm, Nuveena... |
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